Hair Loss Forum - Does DrGho guarantee in writing that there will be no white dots?
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moopookoo

15.03.2012, 04:21
 

Does DrGho guarantee in writing that there will be no white dots? (Hair Multiplication & Stem Cells Treatment)

I know he says that 80% of donor will regenerate so what happens with remainig 20%?
If you had 5000 grafts that would mean 1000 white dots at the back of your head?

Is 1000 dots too many to go unnoticed when you shave your head?
D Saunders seems to be shaving his head after 1 HST treatment




moopookoo is located in [NA] and he is available to meet: NO


Post reply
Iron_Man

15.03.2012, 09:31

@ moopookoo

Does DrGho guarantee in writing that there will be no white dots?

» Is 1000 dots too many to go unnoticed when you shave your head?
» D Saunders seems to be shaving his head after 1 HST treatment

Exactly, he is able to shave his head down to ZERO.

The following photo is definitely a legit photo (lightning is neutral over the whole area etc) taken from this HQ-video:

http://vimeo.com/38325026

They ZOOMED/enlarged this area (photo/link below) because they tried to show viewers “a total Gho-disaster”.
In fact, I would kiss Dr. Gho’s butt for such a “disaster”, because even in this particular area, it occurred almost TOTAL REGROWTH. In addition, it seems the latter (regeneration process) is just still ongoing within some particular “disaster areas”…

FULL SIZE
http://www.fileden.com/files/2012/3/15/3278666/jef-gordon-donor.jpg

With just a very small photo size (below), you might think “gaps or ‘total disaster’” or something …
[image]

Anyway, WHERE are the real WHITE dots even within this particular “disaster area” they zoomed and even with huge enlargement (link above) of the photo??

In fact, instead of white dots, most extraction areas (see all cycles in the pic) are rather pinkish -including small hairs; this indicates, that still “something happens” within the skin/below the surface even after 1 year. It is well-known, that even after 18 month or so, transplanted hairs in the recipient site can suddenly grow where they initially thought it wouldn’t grow anymore. Of course the same can happen with HST grafts in the recipient site, as well with the remaining hair follicle part in the donor site; maybe because initially not enough hair cells remained in the donor site to start the re-growth process. All this is the reason why Dr. Gho reported this:

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/21163581

“RESULTS:
After evaluation of the donor area, sometimes a few little white spots were visible, but almost all hair follicles in the donor site re-produce hairs after 2 years.”

So in my opinion, for an evaluation for donor-regeneration, a patient has to wait at least 18 month – and not 9 or 12 month. The latter could be too early.




Iron_Man is located in [NA] and he is available to meet: NO

---
I documented the world’s 1st day-by-day (HST) donor hair regeneration process …


Post reply
Spanish Dude

15.03.2012, 21:46

@ Iron_Man

Does DrGho guarantee in writing that there will be no white dots?

» “RESULTS:
» After evaluation of the donor area, sometimes a few little white spots were
» visible, but almost all hair follicles in the donor site re-produce
» hairs after 2 years.”
»
» So in my opinion, for an evaluation for donor-regeneration, a patient has
» to wait at least 18 month – and not 9 or 12 month. The latter could
» be too early.

No way. In the JDT magazine, Gho said the donor area regenerates at 97.7% after only 12 months.
Furthermore, Mailman's pictures were taken 4 years after the procedure.

So stop talking BS IronedMan.




Spanish Dude is located in [NA] and he is available to meet: NO


Post reply
Iron_Man

15.03.2012, 21:59

@ Spanish Dude

Does DrGho guarantee in writing that there will be no white dots?

» No way. In the JDT magazine, Gho said the donor area regenerates at 97.7%
» after only 12 months.

Sure, this has simply been the result in this STUDY after 12 month -period.

» Furthermore, Mailman's pictures were taken 4 years after the procedure.

And? Even in Mailman's case it's easy to COUNT the hairless gaps - all in all completely the same calculation as in jef gordon's case. Besides, Mailman got -all in all- 2150 (!) HST grafts extracted in 2005/2006.

» So stop talking BS IronedMan.

No, sorry, not as long as such a real asstalker like you is in this forum. And instead of "no way" - try to PROVE "no way", loser.




Iron_Man is located in [NA] and he is available to meet: NO

---
I documented the world’s 1st day-by-day (HST) donor hair regeneration process …


Post reply
Iron_Man

15.03.2012, 22:14

@ Iron_Man

Does DrGho guarantee in writing that there will be no white dots?

» No, sorry, not as long as such a real asstalker like you is in this forum.
» And instead of "no way" - try to PROVE "no way", loser.

EDIT (just for the loser):
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
http://www.newhair.com/resources/mp-1997-evaluation.asp
A final issue regarding expectations is related to the time frame in which the patient expects to see the results of his procedure. The normal follicular growth cycle is quite variable. In most patients, the majority of the transplanted hair begins to grow at about 3 to 4 months after surgery, with additional hair appearing over the next several months. In a small percentage of patients, the onset of growth of the bulk of the hair can be seen from 4 to 8 months or more, with additional new hair occasionally appearing up to 18 months after the transplant. Since newly transplanted hair will increase in diameter and in length, in this subset of patients, there may be continued cosmetic improvement for up to two years.
<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<
So Spanish Dud,
do you think your friend Rassman lies even in a study paper??




Iron_Man is located in [NA] and he is available to meet: NO

---
I documented the world’s 1st day-by-day (HST) donor hair regeneration process …


Post reply
Skywalker

The Corridor of Uncertainty,
18.03.2012, 18:54
(edited by Skywalker, 18.03.2012, 19:16)

@ Spanish Dude

Does DrGho guarantee in writing that there will be no white dots?

» No way. In the JDT magazine, Gho said the donor area regenerates at 97.7%
» after only 12 months.
» Furthermore, Mailman's pictures were taken 4 years after the procedure.
»
» So stop talking BS IronedMan.

I spoke to Dr Gho personally and he said to me directly that donor regrowth is expected at 80%.


One other point, if the gaps where the 20% don't grow are pinkish (assuming it's 20%) and not white dot scars then that's absolutely fine - good grief, there are 'gaps' in tons of donor areas of balding guys anyway when you cut that close - it doesn't look odd and nobody is going to bat an eyelid.

The white scar dotting is what we're looking to avoid - they are much more important than a few gaps.




Skywalker is located in THE CORRIDOR OF UNCERTAINTY and he is available to meet: NO


Post reply
Iron_Man

18.03.2012, 19:18

@ Skywalker

Does DrGho guarantee in writing that there will be no white dots?

» I spoke to Dr Gho personally and he said to me directly that donor regrowth
» is expected at 80%.

>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
By Skywalker
Topic Title: My Consultation with HASCI on HST (Dr Gho's clinic)
Created On: 11/21/2011 12:07 PM
Although there has been a number of false starts ( notably FM) and disappointments over time I have come to the conclusion that Dr Gho's newer HST technique in all probability does work.

A short while back I arranged a meeting with HASCI to discuss HST in London. It turns out that HASCI doesn't really have a clinic in London, they come over periodically and book a clinic for a few days. Unfortunately they had gone back early this time and there was an oversight so they forgot to tell me !
I did talk to the receptionist for the clinic who was a former nurse - and for what it's worth she said she had witnessed regrowth in the donor area from Dr Gho's technique - hardly conclusive but at least interesting.

Anyway I got in contact with them again, they apologised and agreed to see me outside their normal hours a while later, which was good of them and I felt was a decent response to their error.

To cut a long story short I did eventually see them at the clinic and Dr Gho was there too, which was a surprise to me. Initially I had the consultation with the doctor who I was scheduled to see, I didn't learn anything new as I was well aware of the procedure - except one very disappointing detail - they no longer did the 50 graft test for anybody except the most challenging of cases. I pressed her on this option and she said we could wait to hear what Dr Gho said.

When Dr Gho then came he was adamant that as I was a straightforward case he wouldn't offer the 50 graft test to me, I pushed this by saying it was still on the Internet but he wouldn't budge on it. Basically he has a 6 month waiting list and a 50 graft test is almost as expensive to set up for him as a full procedure.

For me to not have the test available is a major problem, I am a NW6/7 and I cut to stubble (0.5mm), if I am a really bad healer and white dots are left then it is going to look terrible - the language barrier didn't help as their English is OK but not great, however, the situation is clear - for normal cases the 50 graft test is off the table.

Dr Gho started to go through the consent form but I think the lady doctor consultant could tell that I wasn't really interested - this inability to test the procedure was a major blow to me and I needed time to evaluate the situation.

There was some other information that came out of the consultation that might be of interest -:
(1) Regeneration is usually 80-85%
(2) They all regard the procedure as mature and proven, and they say it works on everybody.
(3) There was no concern about working on somebody as severely bald as me once they realised my expectations were reasonable. If this was a scem I would have thought they would steer clear of people like me because lack of regeneration would be MUCH more obvious if it didn't work.
(4) Some people have beard hair that is suitable for HST and some don't - I don't apparently - even though my beard hair is thick and strong. Due to the language barrier I didn't manage to establish why but that was another disappointment and avenue closed to me.
(5) Regenerated hair follicles can be used again but it is a bit more difficult to do so than with a virgin follicle, the yield is a bit lower because when they regenerate they often grow back a bit twisted apparently. This doesn't matter for most people as in subsequent procedures you will usually not end up extracting the same follicles too many times but for me it is relevant as my donor is much more limited. This was yet another incident which for me was against this being a scem - he mentioned this in passing but if it was a scem why would you bring up this slight limitation ?

I thanked them for their time and left to think about it - and I am still thinking about it To proceed without a test is risky for me because if white dotting were to occur I would be really fäked.

As to my opinion on whether the procedure is legitimate, well, I am not 100% sure because I haven't had it done, but if it is a scäm it must be the best scäm in history because too many people are having it done now and my 'gut' is also telling me that Dr Gho is on the level.

One other point - I can see why they have not yet been able to market this product properly to the world yet, Dr Gho came over as a genuine and warm guy but he is really a scientist, not a business manager. Frankly in terms of running a business it came over to me as 'amateur night'
<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<

Could you please explain the "twisted hairs" part again - without being plagued by any language barrier?




Iron_Man is located in [NA] and he is available to meet: NO

---
I documented the world’s 1st day-by-day (HST) donor hair regeneration process …


Post reply
Iron_Man

18.03.2012, 19:38

@ Skywalker

Does DrGho guarantee in writing that there will be no white dots?

» » No way. In the JDT magazine, Gho said the donor area regenerates at
» 97.7%
» » after only 12 months.
» » Furthermore, Mailman's pictures were taken 4 years after the procedure.
» »
» » So stop talking BS IronedMan.
»
» I spoke to Dr Gho personally and he said to me directly that donor regrowth
» is expected at 80%.

Concerning the (re-)growth part even after more than 12 month - even the Replicel jokers know this, but Spanish Rude doesn't know ... :-D
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
Replicel: “In state-of-the-art micro-surgical procedures, in the first few months all the hair fibre in the area of the surgery falls out and begins to reappear around the six month time frame. It normally can take up to 18 months for the success or failure of the micro-surgery to become evident.
[…]
Replicel: “Even in the worst case scenario—i.e. zero response above the initial baseline at 6 months, we continue to gather the data through 12 and 24 months. Responders can come later, as is seen with micro transplants.”
[…]
http://nbtequitiesresearch.com/report/great-interview-wreplicel-ceo-on-ending-world-baldness
<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<
That means, that when Gho says "the donor area regenerates at 97.7% after only 12 month" - that doesn't mean you can have, in fact, 100% regrowth after 18 month. MAYBE that's the reason why e.g. Gerard Joling had his 2nd procedure after 18 month - his donor area looks "virgin"/untouched after 18 month. I myself, I would rather wait 18 month and not 12 month for the next procedure, in case IF the whole donor area is needed (again).




Iron_Man is located in [NA] and he is available to meet: NO

---
I documented the world’s 1st day-by-day (HST) donor hair regeneration process …


Post reply
Spanish Dude

19.03.2012, 19:54

@ moopookoo

Does DrGho guarantee in writing that there will be no white dots?

AFAIK, there is no written guarantee re. the donor regrowth. Not in the contract.
I think patients should demand this to be guaranteed on the contract.



» I know he says that 80% of donor will regenerate so what happens with
» remainig 20%?
» If you had 5000 grafts that would mean 1000 white dots at the back of your
» head?
»
» Is 1000 dots too many to go unnoticed when you shave your head?
» D Saunders seems to be shaving his head after 1 HST treatment




Spanish Dude is located in [NA] and he is available to meet: NO


Post reply
moopookoo

20.03.2012, 10:04

@ Spanish Dude

Does DrGho guarantee in writing that there will be no white dots?

» AFAIK, there is no written guarantee re. the donor regrowth. Not in the
» contract.
» I think patients should demand this to be guaranteed on the contract.
»


I agree with this, it should be written in the contract, no doubt



if it not in the contract how do you complain if it doesnt regenerate, i guess you can always tape him




moopookoo is located in [NA] and he is available to meet: NO


Post reply
Iron_Man

20.03.2012, 10:45

@ moopookoo

Does DrGho guarantee in writing that there will be no white dots?

» if it not in the contract how do you complain if it doesnt regenerate, i
» guess you can always tape him

How do YOU know that your donor didn't regenerate?

If you do not know this within 2-3 weeks after the procedure - never. There is almost no way to know this - even if you shave your head or donor area down to zero.

There're lots of ways to check donor regrowth - below you can see just 1 example.
[image]
They offer you such checks for free anyhow.

Some normal photos like these within 2 weeks ...
http://www.hairsite.com/hair-loss/board_entry-id-82743.html#p82792
... are also sufficient.

btw - what told Dr. Gho S. Kobren concerning the topic 'guarantee'?

http://youtu.be/xapYyuI0lVA
(>min 22:20)

Whether your head is completely shaved or just partially shaved, it doesn't matter - you can always make good quality photos yourself EVERY DAY from your extraction area up to 2 weeks or more after the procedure. Sure, I know, it's extremely difficult to find the right button on a digicam for making photos.

» if it not in the contract how do you complain if it doesnt regenerate, i
» guess you can always tape him

Simply send the tape to the CIA, FBI, NSA, KGB, MI5, MI6 etc guys for an analysis.




Iron_Man is located in [NA] and he is available to meet: NO

---
I documented the world’s 1st day-by-day (HST) donor hair regeneration process …


Post reply
Skywalker

The Corridor of Uncertainty,
20.03.2012, 19:03

@ Iron_Man

Does DrGho guarantee in writing that there will be no white dots?

»
» Could you please explain the "twisted hairs" part again - without being
» plagued by any language barrier?

I had never heard this before, but whilst we were discussing my situation with the other doctor called Marleen Dr Gho mentioned that when you got regrowth in the donor area some of the hairs/follicles grew back "twisted" (I think this was below the skin but I'm not sure). This twisting made the hairs/follicles that had grown back a little harder to extract if they were selected for a second extraction so he felt the 2nd pass sometimes caused the process to have a slightly higher complication rate - but he didn't regard it as a big deal and Marleen didn't even seem to confirm that she had experienced the issue.

This was part of a conversation and only lasted about 15-20 seconds, I suggest somebody else asks him about it, I think it is only a marginal issue.




Skywalker is located in THE CORRIDOR OF UNCERTAINTY and he is available to meet: NO


Post reply

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